On March 23, 2018, Zygor Guides announced that they would end support for their ESO guide. Later, via answers given on the forums, they confirmed they would not add a leveling guide for Summerset. Their guide is Public Domain with Zygor's blessing for the community to create guides. So I took it upon myself to create a Summerset guide for the ESO community.

Wrathguard: (Caution) The martial Eredar of the Burning Legion, these soldiers enact the will of the masters of their cause. Where the Felguard often charge crazed into battle, the Wrathguard operate under a singular purpose that is to protect their charges and to strike precisely against the enemies of the Burning Legion. Just the same, the Eredar Wrathguard are not to be trifled with, showcasing a pinnacle threat to any demon hunter unfortunate enough to summon one during their ritual. However, those that are capable of defeating these outstanding soldiers and maintaining their power would no doubt be imbued with the same physical endurance and threatening presence as that which now labors within them to escape.
Why was this downvoted? The swing analogy is horrible. There’s nothing physical that’s going to change when u play the game the exact same way as 04 05 06. The difference is u know what’s going on as opposed to not knowing where anything is. A good analogy would be playing Pokémon red again after beating the elite 4. The game itself won’t be any worse, it just will be easier and maybe less enjoyable if all you enjoyed is the aspect of not knowing where to go. But this is why pvp servers are magical, because each time you level a character, your leveling experience is different based on the encounters that happen while questing. In 05 U may have breezed through stv, but in classic u may spend an hour on a single quest solely because of the competition between factions on that particular quest.
Good question. Me personally, when I use a new strat from somebody else, I always read thru the strat, and in the case I really need to level some pet, I then (likely) exclude strats that are mentioning things like “RNG”, “risk”, etc. But: I’m always happy (when using a new strat) when I see some detailed infos, so that I can estimate what is going to happen. But YMMV.
The first demon hunters, whether enthralled by the sight of Illidan Stormrage cutting down swaths of demons during the War of the Ancients, stumbling upon a rogue demon hunter in their eternal quest to slaughter the Burning Legion, somehow forcing themselves into the destroyed realm of Outland, or by secret scrolls that have been found in night elven lands, the Night Elf demon hunter has more avenues than Blood Elves to become the predator of demons. Most, if not all Player Character Night Elf demon hunters, are going to be shackled to the fact that they became demon hunters sometime after the War of the Ancients. This is ambiguous due to the information received in World of Warcraft: Legion by the character Illysanna Ravencrest in her Dungeon Journal entry, “The daughter of Lord Ravencrest, imprisoned for millennia in the Vault of the Wardens shortly after the War of Ancients, found herself free after Maiev released the demon hunters from their prison. Returning to her ancestral home, she has sacrificed everything - including her very soul - to defend what she could not during the War of the Ancients,” being taken by some people as evidence of her being a demon hunter either during the War of the Ancients.  

Why was this downvoted? The swing analogy is horrible. There’s nothing physical that’s going to change when u play the game the exact same way as 04 05 06. The difference is u know what’s going on as opposed to not knowing where anything is. A good analogy would be playing Pokémon red again after beating the elite 4. The game itself won’t be any worse, it just will be easier and maybe less enjoyable if all you enjoyed is the aspect of not knowing where to go. But this is why pvp servers are magical, because each time you level a character, your leveling experience is different based on the encounters that happen while questing. In 05 U may have breezed through stv, but in classic u may spend an hour on a single quest solely because of the competition between factions on that particular quest.
To get back to Classic for a bit, this is what I think is happening. Players who prefer the old ways (and full disclosure, I'd count myself among them, but to a smaller degree than most) complain/talk about the negative sides of modern WoW and Battle for Azeroth in general. While they do this they also talk about how things were better before and often mention Vanilla as a reference point. People who enjoy BfA now feel attacked by this and so they retaliate. Hence, liking Classic means you either have nostalgia goggles on or have no idea what you're talking about and will hate the same things you say you want 2 weeks after you start playing it. It's an amazing thing, where literally each side is doing to the other what they feel is being (wrongly) done to them. I feel like writing this is the most redundant thing I've ever done, and yet I also feel that it needs to be said, because it seems some people just don't get what they're doing, or at least I hope they don't (some do and are doing it on purpose but there's trolls everywhere so there's no point in even discussing them).

All of this is keeping with the spirit of vanilla, which I think is more important than that a specific number be 11 instead of 12. And it would help to "resize the swing" by making the game harder to the more experienced community, and forcing people to re-discover the game rather than simply looking up whatever they want to know on a spreadsheet somewhere.
One player said in a comment posted in response to the list, “Yeah people don’t realize the sheer enormity of game system evolution WoW has gone through since release. I’m not the biggest fan of BoA by any stretch, but I’ve played since closed beta vanilla, and I doubt I’ll be going back to classic. Leveling was painful. Experiencing these old systems once was enough.”
It is completely acceptable, but harder to write, that your character has been a demon hunter sometime after the War of the Ancients. This is no different than people who have written ancient druids, and it poses the same exact problems in writing. I would not recommend this to anyone who is not a seasoned veteran when it comes to writing characters, as the longer your character has been a demon hunter, the older your character is, the more difficult to control the fel magic within, the more detached from society, and the more withdrawn they may become. Overall, it becomes incredibly harder to write.
The Horde 12-20 (Barrens + Stonetalon Mountains) guide has been rewritten and revamped.  In addition, there has been numerous tweaks to the speedrun route to make things faster and easier to follow.  Also, in case you haven't noticed I am now adding about 40% more info per step and redoing all the images.  Unlike with my previous vanilla guides, I am now giving a brief explanation of where to go and what to do with each step along with any other helpful tips.
If a companion dies during the battle, it will need to be resurrected before it can participate in another encounter or be summoned as a traveling companion. Get that pet a medic! Or in this case, a Stable Master. Stable Master NPCs can heal and revive your pets for a small fee, and there is no cooldown on the Stable Master's heal. You’ll find Stable Masters in major towns and cities across Azeroth.
One of my favorite features is the Smart Injection System, which automatically determines the optimal place for your character to get started with the guides, based on your level and quest history. In other words, it doesn’t matter what level you are currently, you can jump right in and continue seamlessly with the guides. It also means that you don’t have to be a slave to the guides, they work perfectly even if you’re also leveling in instances, battlegrounds, using heirlooms or rested EXP. If your level ever gets ahead of the guide, just use the built-in feature to skip to the right place again. Very cool.
Even though the guide was developed with a hunter, the guide can be followed by any class.  Except you have to do your class's quests which aren't a whole lot.  I do have full intention to make my guide friendly with all classes in the future by listing all of their steps as well.  There will be a toggle that allows you to show which class's steps you want to see in the guide.  But this is coming later.

Things like Tauren melee reach being bigger, which is something I experienced going away live during Black Temple Illidan progression (at least for that particular encounter), is confusing to players as it's a significant advantage over other races in some instances. No quest tracking is another apparently confusing issue, as many Mankirk's WIfe seekers well know, and there's a whole lot more where that came from:


“To fill our pool of beta and stress test participants, we’ll be choosing dedicated players who meet select criteria from both the WoW Classic beta opt-in and the standard Warcraft beta opt-in. Participants will also need to have an active subscription or active game time on their Battle.net Account. While opting-in to the beta is the primary way to make sure you’re in the running to join the test it doesn’t guarantee an invitation to the closed beta test. We may also consider additional factors such as how long a player has been subscribed to the game so that we have the right mix of players to ensure great feedback toward making WoW Classic the very best experience for the community.”
Doomguard: The Doomguard serve as the Burning Legion’s lieutenants, captains, and generals. While it is incredibly unlikely that a demon hunter would be capable of defeating a Doomguard within their summoning circle, those that succeed would be granted overwhelming and overbearing power, the like that few would be able to contain. However, just as the Doomguard serve as the Burning Legion’s battlefield leadership, perhaps a sliver of that might be imbued within the handful of demon hunters capable of binding themselves with one and surviving.
Regardless of the brotherhood shared by the Illidari in their single-minded mission, there is a level of disconnect between Lord Illidan’s demon hunters and the rest of his forces. While this is by no means enforced, it is basically self-imposed by the demon hunters themselves, as the blood elves inhabiting the Grand Promenade had no issue to Vandel spending some of his free time there with their denizens. Furthermore, the bond of brotherhood is not as strong as one might expect between two demon hunters, as during their training and sparring sessions, there is nothing that stops one party from killing another so long as they maintain control of their inner-demons. Just the same, there are those within Illidan’s forces that zealously believe and follow his teachings, mentality, and machinations without question but it is not wholly uncommon for some demon hunters to either question, doubt, or even outright disagree with their lord’s ideals and methods.
Other methods have been discussed. For example, mods could be crippled. DBM didn't exist back then, and the other boss that did that I don't remember the name of, didn't do as much back then as DBM does now. If our goal is to recreate the experience as it was, then obviously not having DBM would be a reasonable way to accomplish that. DBM simply existing, makes the game today easier than it was. So disallow it. Again, this is completely consistent with the spirit of vanilla. Remember one-button-decursing? That was nerfed. They crippled the capabilities of the modding API to disallow that because it made the game too easy. So what if they cripple it a little bit more to once again make the game less easy?
Sharding eliminates server load and realm stability. Cross-realm sharding is here so that players are evenly distributed across realms and helps combat underpopulation. Sharding at launch is vital to ensure a stable launch of an expansion. Starting zones would be filled with millions of people and that would turn even accepting a quest into a nightmare. Disadvantages of Sharding
26 ADP, The Fall of the Black Temple: most of the demon hunters are dispatched to Marduun, leaving behind very few, including Vandel. Vandel fights with Maeiv, trying to appeal to her reason and is left for dead. In the end, Illidan is defeated as we see in the Black Temple, and in the wake of Illidan’s defeat, Vandel hears his voice call out to him, urging him to be prepared.
If your pet's health gets too low or its attacks aren't very effective against a certain combatant, you can always switch out your current pet with another companion on your team. Only pets that are considered active (i.e., those in your three Battle Pet Slots), may be switched in and out during the battle. Once the match is over, you can always change up your active pet team, which is useful if one of your pets is low on health or dead.
Thanks so much for the replies. I think I am somewhat of a collector/roster builder. I go around doing the dailies but I also like buying pets just for their looks. I watched hazelnutty on youtube last night. I think I will focus on doing the expeditions when I have time to get all the pets that come from that. Then I will go back and do old raids like Eekwibble suggested.
I'm not all that hardcore on "Classic", I want to relive the old zones and the old world and it seems like most people I'm taking to is feeling the same. We would prefer to have quality of life improvements regardless of them actually being in the game at in 1.12.2 or not. Like the "Automatic Quest Tracking" to actually track it properly without you having to actually trigger progress in the quest for it to show up would make perfect sense. It's no real need to make such a thing behave nonsensical just because it's "authentic".
Beginning May 15, select WoW players will be invited to participate in a small-scale, focused closed beta test. Players will also get a chance to help put our servers and technology through their paces in a series of stress tests running from May through July—you can opt in now through Account Management and select the WoW Classic beta. Subsequent stress tests will extend the opportunity to even more players. Level caps will also be in place to ensure we’re emphasizing the “stress” in “stress test” 

Unlike their night elven brothers-in-arms, the blood elven demon hunters have only one true avenue to their becoming what they are: the Sunfury. What this means for the character is that they were part of the coalition of elves to follow Kael’thas Sunstrider away from Quel’thalas in the wake of the Sunwell’s destruction. These same elves were present (and survived) the attacks on Northrend by Illidan Stormrage, Kael’thas, and Lady Vashj as well as the conquering of Outland through shackling Magtheridon. The Sunfury elves who had either proven themselves capable enough, sworn vendetta against the Burning Legion, and remained loyal to the Illidari in the wake of Kael’thas’ betrayal would prove capable of becoming demon hunters in the footsteps of Varedis Felsoul, the first blood elven demon hunter.
Combat is turn-based and there is no time limit on each round in a PVE Pet Battle. You can take your time to determine which spell to use next. Some pet abilities have multiple round cooldowns, while others can do extra damage if certain conditions are met. Be creative and have fun testing which combination of attacks works best against different wild pets!

I am currently working full time on my Vanilla WoW leveling guides.  Soon there will be a 1-60 speed leveling guide for Alliance, along with in-game guide versions available for my members area.  As of right now, there is no members area, but if you would like to show support for my efforts into this project, you can simply donate to me via Patreon if you like (you will get some cool rewards in return).  Or you can donate directly with PayPal if you like.  All donations are highly appreciated and they will only motivate me more to continue making the best vanilla WoW leveling guides on the web.


The World of Warcraft is going back to its roots with WoW Classic. Giving players the chance to return to the game as it was around the time of its launch, WoW Classic is set to launch worldwide on August 27. However, ahead of its imminent release, the team at Blizzard are offering a closed beta test for WoW Classic, and we’ve got all the details players need to jump in on the action.
Thanks for stopping by! I'm Crzypck, officer, Raid Leader, and tank of Mist on Area 52, and the official raid guide writer partnered with Limit, the US#1 and World #2 guild. This is the home page for Limit's Official Battle of Dazar'alor Mythic Raid Guide. Every strategy guide has been thoroughly discussed, reviewed, and approved by officers from Limit.
This tutorial will ensure that the beginning of your journey will be a smooth one. It provides information that will help you find your way when you get lost, as well as tips that will offer guidance and advice as you march on towards greatness. It is not an exhaustive guide, however; it neither can nor wants to unveil every secret of Azeroth to you. That glorious task is left up to you as you explore the world yourself. Think of this guide as a touchstone for your early adventures: enough to get started, but too little to spoil any of the awesome surprises that await you in Azeroth.
Blizzard also announced a boxed Collector's Edition for World of Warcraft to ring in the game's 15th anniversary. It includes a Onyxia pin, map of Azeroth mouse pad, art prints, special anniversary mounts, and a large black-and-gold statue of Ragnaros the Firelord. It will release on October 8 for $100, and you can pre-purchase from the Blizzard store.
3. Your DH wants to make sure they're in on any information about the Legion that anyone else may have, and this would include the occasional visit to cities, where information flows densely and freely, and it's easier than trying to weasel your way into military meetings with military units that might not really trust your fel-infused butt. But if Mr General is having an ale at the bar, you can probably get him to blab at least something he might know that hasn't been shared yet, especially if you've provoked him into ranting at you just with your mere presence.
Succubus: In the same vein as the imp avoids harm, the succubus is known for slipping in and out of sight on the battlefields, attacking when least expected, and relishing in the pain delivered to their opponents. In the same vein, both pain and pleasure enact a power to the succubus. To the demon hunter bound to a succubus, this might showcase itself with a particular knack for invisibility spells, turning pain into power, and even an affinity with the use of charm spells.
Allied Races Overview Everything about Allied Races, new playable races in World of Warcraft: Battle for Azeroth, including unlock requirements for each race, Heritage Armor, customization options, and speculation when they are playable. Battle for Azeroth (110-120) Leveling Tips and Consumables How to level from 110 to 120 as quickly as possible in WoW Battle for Azeroth, including recommended zone order, best consumables, general leveling tips, and best addons. Azerite Armor Overview and FAQ Everything known about Azerite Armor and Azerite Traits in Battle for Azeroth including what Heart of Azeroth Level they unlock and how to respec them using an Azerite Reforger. The Battle for Lordaeron - Introductory Battle for Azeroth Quests This guide is an overview of the Battle for Lordaeron scenario, including a walkthrough from both Alliance and Horde points of view. Wowhead's Guide on How to Play World of Warcraft The basics of getting started in World of Warcraft as a brand-new player. Game installation, character creation, how to move, and complete your first quest.
I have tried it a few times. It's good if you're new to the game. Otherwise not so much. I found I leveled slower by using it, as it's suggesting to take the longest possible route usually. Basically following roads everytime, when you could take an easy shortcut. Especially if the shortcut involves a bit of fall damage, it's out of question. The "go here" spots don't also update if you take a shortcut, and then the waypoint arrow points to wrong direction. But perhaps it has been updated since then.
All of this is keeping with the spirit of vanilla, which I think is more important than that a specific number be 11 instead of 12. And it would help to "resize the swing" by making the game harder to the more experienced community, and forcing people to re-discover the game rather than simply looking up whatever they want to know on a spreadsheet somewhere.
Each battle that you win will yield experience for each pet that participated. However, deceased companions will not receive any experience (so make an effort to keep them alive by swaping in a different pet). Experience gains are based on your pet's level compared to the wild pet. Defeating a higher level opponent will grant more experience than a much lower level one, but be ready for a tough fight! 

Although the Battle Pet Trainer will only offer to teach you your race-specific companion, it is possible to add all of these pets to your collection. You can either find them in your faction’s auction house or you can create a character of the race whose pet you would like to learn. Using your new character, you can seek out any battle pet trainer in major cities. After you learn the pet, you can delete the character; the pet you learned will not be removed from your collection.
Instead of sharding the zones, their plan is to shard the entire continent at launch. In Classic WoW, there are no dynamic spawns and questing in starting zones would quickly become annoying, so it's understandable that the game is all but fun when there are no mobs to kill, but layering will also cause you to see new players, every time you sign in to the game, which is a clear downside of the tech. 
5. Spending time actually leisurely talking with others once in a while is actually good for your sanity. If the only entity you're ever communicating with for days to weeks at a time is the demon soul inside of you, it might be hard not to start losing touch and eventually your marbles, especially if your inner demon is especially manipulative (nathrezim, shivarra, succubus, etc) and does more than just constantly offer you MOARPOWAH. However, you might be terrified of actually getting attached to anyone, you don't want the Legion to use that against you. Random, fleeting encounters with complete strangers in taverns and the like is the middle ground you need, to see all of these people and (well hopefully, depends on the crowd) remember what you're trying to protect in the first place, to maybe see children shopping with mama in the market place, or to hear some soldier in the bar talking about his old man back home.
No he's just not paying attention. The wanted quests are built into both the leveling guides and the "Zandalar Forever" achievement guide. They aren't in the rep guide because they are not repeatable and by the time you hit max level they should be done. You'll also notice the rep guide doesn't contain every single possible completable quest that rewards rep. It is designed to focus on repeatable objectives, world quests, large quest lines, and missions.
Simply playing the auction house can be the most lucrative gold making ventures if you have a sizable gold staff and you're not afraid to spend it. Just like a real world stock market, prices of items traded on the Auction House fluctuate daily, creating opportunities to buy low and sell high. Zygor's Gold and Auctions guide finds items that are selling at record lows for you to buy them out!

Within the context of Classic, the method most frequently proposed is to re-tune bosses to make them harder. Rather than copying the numbers, re-create the relative difficulty. Kind of like, when you first start working out, you use small weights. When you get stronger, you lift bigger weights. The WoW community is more knowledgeable, more experienced, has better hardware, etc. We're "stronger." So give us tougher bosses. There are a lot of forms that could take. Bosses were constantly re-tuned during vanilla anyway, so if Ragnaros does 10% more damage or something, is that really a problem? I don't think it is. What about resistance gear? back in the day, collecting resist gear was a thing people did. But the numbers and strategies are so well known today that only the tank really needs it anymore. Bosses could be re-tuned with more resistible elemental damage so that's important for entire raids to gear appropriately. That would be entirely keeping with the spirit of vanilla even if the actually numbers sitting in a database somewhere were different than they were ~13 years ago. If you want to go a little farther, a few people have proposed adding new abilities to old bosses, adjusting their timing, etc. 

Different qualities aren't limited only to wild pets—many rare World drops and special non-wild companions have had their stats boosted. For example, the world-drop dragon whelps (Azure Whelpling, Crimson Whelpling, Dark Whelpling, and Emerald Whelpling) are of [rare] quality. Check your Pet Journal to see the color-coded rarity of your non-wild pets.
This is definitely why we do a beta test. We can also do things like reset the realm at a busy time like 4:30pm PDT to try and find the source of a certain issue where a crocolisk is losing it’s brain due to how multiple processes are interacting and mirroring code to form a cohesive world. There were similar types of issues like this back in 2004 but we wanted to try and resolve this one before the weekend for the folks who are testing.
You’ll get a small window inside the game with instructions for what you need to do next, every step of the way to 120. You’ll also get a waypoint arrow that points you in the right direction to go at all times. If this sounds extremely convenient, you’re right! Zygor’s leveling guide/addon has completely taken the frustration out of leveling for me, personally. No more reading comments on WoWHead about how to complete quests. No more getting stuck, frustrated and bored with leveling. And no more feeling like WoW takes too much effort.

The World of Warcraft is going back to its roots with WoW Classic. Giving players the chance to return to the game as it was around the time of its launch, WoW Classic is set to launch worldwide on August 27. However, ahead of its imminent release, the team at Blizzard are offering a closed beta test for WoW Classic, and we’ve got all the details players need to jump in on the action.
In Classic, playing different classes actually feels different in more ways than just their abilities, at least if you think about it a little. Playing a priest, you really want to find a group because that's what the class was designed for, which is both good and bad - you're stuck very slowly leveling if you're solo, emphasizing the frustration of the slow pulling, but having different classes require different gameplay can be good. If you want to play a priest you're going to have to be more social by default, just whisper the guy you see killing stuff next to you and go level together, you'll immediately have a better time of it (this part is particularly exacerbated in the beta, as there are fewer players).

Swim Speed Potions (used especially at lvl 37 for Faldir's Cove in Arathi Highlands and lvl 57 in WPL).  Try to get multiple stacks of these.  I also recommend keeping a stack of these always in your bags.  You will frequently pass rivers and lakes and can use these potions to pass them faster through out the guide.  Please note that these potions do not stack with Druid's Aquatic Form and Glyph of Aquatic Form.


Question: for the demons listed, I'm particularly curious about Nathrezim or the new 'Inquisitors'. Basically because I want a very cunning, manipulative demon and strategist that my guy absorbs. However I am unsure if this is feasible, as I don't know their status and although my Demon Hunter is a proven warrior... well, he wasn't one who stood too much above the others. (Working on the backstory, but one thing I am fairly certain of though may change is he pleaded to be allowed to take the trial to become a demon hunter with the next group Prince Kael was sending to Illidan.) So although he might get lucky, I can't see him overpowering someone who is as powerful as some others.

Bonz has the upper hand, as his Zombie-Type monsters gain a 30% ATK and DEF bonus because of the Graveyard Field, and when they are destroyed, they just regenerate, and become even stronger from "Call of the Haunted". However, when Yugi and the gang arrive, Joey manages to figure out the Zombie's main weakness and that is their DEF is 0. Using "Shield & Sword" to switch their ATK and DEF values, Joey wins the Duel. Bandit Keith then locks the gang in, double crosses his three companions, and enters the Duelist Kingdom Finals after taking Zygor and Sid's five Star Chips by force.
It is completely acceptable, but harder to write, that your character has been a demon hunter sometime after the War of the Ancients. This is no different than people who have written ancient druids, and it poses the same exact problems in writing. I would not recommend this to anyone who is not a seasoned veteran when it comes to writing characters, as the longer your character has been a demon hunter, the older your character is, the more difficult to control the fel magic within, the more detached from society, and the more withdrawn they may become. Overall, it becomes incredibly harder to write.
Step-by-step class guides are on the way!  The 1-12 Mulgore Guide is the first guide to get all the individual class steps.  At the top of the guide, simply select which class you are playing and the page will dynamically update all the steps in the guide for that class (both text and images).  The rest of the guides will be slowly updated overtime to include all the class steps, but you can see how it's going to work with the 1-12 Mulgore.  I want to thank crazyK and his Placeholderguild for helping me out with the individual class content.  They are allowing me to get the 1-60 Alliance guide done while also getting all the class steps done at the same time, so everything can be ready for Classic launch (hopefully). 

To actually get access to the beta, which has already started and continue to add more players, you need to sign up via your Blizzard account management page. Under Games & Subscriptions, scroll down to Beta Access and visit the Beta Profile Settings page. Once there, you’ll see a grid of available betas you can opt into. Once you’ve checked WoW Classic, hit Update Preferences and you’re set.
Blizzard also announced a boxed Collector's Edition for World of Warcraft to ring in the game's 15th anniversary. It includes a Onyxia pin, map of Azeroth mouse pad, art prints, special anniversary mounts, and a large black-and-gold statue of Ragnaros the Firelord. It will release on October 8 for $100, and you can pre-purchase from the Blizzard store.
To get back to Classic for a bit, this is what I think is happening. Players who prefer the old ways (and full disclosure, I'd count myself among them, but to a smaller degree than most) complain/talk about the negative sides of modern WoW and Battle for Azeroth in general. While they do this they also talk about how things were better before and often mention Vanilla as a reference point. People who enjoy BfA now feel attacked by this and so they retaliate. Hence, liking Classic means you either have nostalgia goggles on or have no idea what you're talking about and will hate the same things you say you want 2 weeks after you start playing it. It's an amazing thing, where literally each side is doing to the other what they feel is being (wrongly) done to them. I feel like writing this is the most redundant thing I've ever done, and yet I also feel that it needs to be said, because it seems some people just don't get what they're doing, or at least I hope they don't (some do and are doing it on purpose but there's trolls everywhere so there's no point in even discussing them).
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